Internet dating

[Solarflair]

In my experience they are enthusiastic, committed, convinced they aren't as bright or quick-witted as the young (which means they're not cocky and have no need to indicate a high level of "boredom"), and have a perspective, desire and determination that I often wished young students would show.

No DrS, I'm afraid you're quite wrong, and anyone can see that my anecdote is far worthier than yours.

Here's an example, which contains no real evidence, but nevertheless proves I'm right:

Behold, a lecture hall, in a college of Brunel University, 1996. A lecturer expounds on various aspects of Biological Psychology but is distracted by middle-aged mature students constantly, and I mean constantly interrupting with 'witty' comments such as "you know the test on mental stability, we should try it on each other!" (cue massive guffaws from the MSs) and "Ooh, yes that happened to my daughter! I think she gets it from me!" (another hideous, shrieking gale of laughter), swiftly followed by "some shit about my cat".

During these interruptions, the 'normals' were seething. And this happened regularly throughout my three years. What made it worse was the lecturer's indulgence - not once did he ask them to keep quiet, save it until the seminars etc, and it boggled the mind that people could be that old and not have the social skills to pick up when a room of over a hundred people is willing them to shut the hell up.

It would be ten times worse now that students are paying tuition fee - I can picture very angry scenes i.e. "I pay to listen to the lecturer, not to you!"

So, I'm sure you have no choice but to concede that mature students = demon spawn.

[DrS]

I don't see how I can be "quite wrong" when it's my experience. It might be different to yours, but it can't be right or wrong! And I don't see that "worthiness" comes into it.

I don't recall being interrupted once other than for an intelligent question from any mature students in my lectures. Seminars were different, but then students were meant to talk. Of course their life experiences came into it then, but I found generally that their age had given them insights that the younger students benefited from.

[Pebble]

No DrS, I'm afraid you're quite wrong, and anyone can see that my anecdote is far worthier than yours.

Here's an example, which contains no real evidence, but nevertheless proves I'm right:

Behold, a lecture hall, in a college of Brunel University, 1996. A lecturer expounds on various aspects of Biological Psychology but is distracted by middle-aged mature students constantly, and I mean constantly interrupting with 'witty' comments such as "you know the test on mental stability, we should try it on each other!" (cue massive guffaws from the MSs) and "Ooh, yes that happened to my daughter! I think she gets it from me!" (another hideous, shrieking gale of laughter), swiftly followed by "some shit about my cat".

During these interruptions, the 'normals' were seething. And this happened regularly throughout my three years. What made it worse was the lecturer's indulgence - not once did he ask them to keep quiet, save it until the seminars etc, and it boggled the mind that people could be that old and not have the social skills to pick up when a room of over a hundred people is willing them to shut the hell up.

It would be ten times worse now that students are paying tuition fee - I can picture very angry scenes i.e. "I pay to listen to the lecturer, not to you!"

So, I'm sure you have no choice but to concede that mature students = demon spawn.

This appears to me a description of an incomptetent lecturer and/or bored students. Older students I have taught are significantly more interested in the subject that having undertaken the effort to commit themselves to, apply themselves diligently. I have to worry about courses that attract older students who clearly have no respect for the lecturers/lectures provided.

[Solarflair]

I don't see how I can be "quite wrong" when it's my experience. It might be different to yours, but it can't be right or wrong! And I don't see that "worthiness" comes into it.

If I could, I'd re-write my entire post with a MASSIVE tongue-in-cheek smiley, even though I was really hoping that the phrase "Here's an example, which contains no real evidence, but nevertheless proves I'm right:" would cover it!

[DrS]

Ah ...

Irony detector on standby mode, evidently

[Solarflair]

Seminars were different, but then students were meant to talk. Of course their life experiences came into it then, but I found generally that their age had given them insights that the younger students benefited from.

My version's more eloquent:

"And then they'll justify this inane crap by claiming that their mediocre, banal life experiences are somehow relevant to the seminar!"

Can I ask if you know for a fact that your younger students are appreciating their input? The way I remember it, the mature students' interjections were exasperating and unwelcome, as was their arrogant assumption that their age gave them insights that we would benefit from.

[DrS]

It's an interesting question, and I suspect that many didn't appreciate the input in seminars from older students. I also suspect, however, that this was because many didn't really want to be there! Others, though, clearly found the different perspectives brought by different life experiences valuable. As I say, it wasn't an issue in lectures, at least not in mine.

[Janot]

This goes for all mature students in any subject. This may be an unfair generalisation, but every single one of them, without exception, will talk about their kids, drivel on about their myriad illnesses ..and make 'old-people' noises.

This is indeed a ridiculous generalization unworthy of anyone with a degree. Having been a mature student myself (second time round), out of the couple of dozen other mature students I know, exactly one would have come in the category you describe. He had had a couple of strokes with total memory loss and was profoundly deaf, so rather problematic anyway, but the others were predominantly balanced and unassuming people who were infinitely more interesting than the 'normal' students who were all totally preoccupied with who did what to whom the previous evening.

[chaggle]

This is indeed a ridiculous generalization unworthy of anyone with a degree.

But worthy therefore, by inference, of someone without a degree?
Careful Janot - I don't expect I'm the only one here without one

[Janot]

But worthy therefore, by inference, of someone without a degree?
Careful Janot - I don't expect I'm the only one here without one

Jeez - what a minefield, but your inference is quite wrong. If I say X is not expected from group Y, it does not follow that X is automatically expected from group NOT Y. Ridiculous generalizations are no part of the critical thinking one might expect from somebody who has followed a degree course successfully. This is, after all, part of what a degree course is supposed to train. Expressed in a more exact manner, I should have said it is unworthy of anybody, but particularly disappointing from somebody who has undertaken formal training which should avoid it. How's that, or am I just digging a hole for myself ?

[polomint38]

How's that, or am I just digging a hole for myself ?

[Croydon Bob]

I don't expect I'm the only one here without one

Polomint failed his GCSEs...

I'm very proud of my degree, it cost me $25. $5 more than it cost me to become a bishop.

[Solarflair]

This is indeed a ridiculous generalization...

Oh, I agree. However, I'm a bit stunned that anyone on a skeptics forum would take so seriously any sentence beginning "This goes for all mature students in any subject. This may be an unfair generalisation, but every single one of them, without exception, will..."

I'd politely refer you to the tone of my following posts

Although, I really should make more use of this smiley

[Janot]

Although, I really should make more use of this smiley

It is surprising how others interpret the written post, which is far more open to a totally false interpretation than the spoken word accompanied by facial expression. One reason I suppose for banning the burka, but I guess I might be going off-topic....