"non-evasive psychic surgery"

[Dubious Dick]

I have previously highlighted the remarkable similarity in the channelling of Abraham to Colin Frys Magnus. Almost uncanny!!

Ideally this would have been a two or three parter, where the moral problems of false hope, and the issues with Mannion offering his 'medical' opinions could have been examined in more detail.

As others have said. it certainly will not stop believers believing. In talking to Emeka today, I got the impression that he really wanted to make it more of a film about why people believe, and that the issue of hope is at the heart of this.

[bindeweede]

Harrow 'psychic' under investigationhttp://www.harrowobserver.co.uk/west-london-news/local-harrow-news/2009/03/25/harrow-psychic-under-investigation-116451-23230685/

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

http://www.harrowobserver.co.uk/west-london-news/local-harrow-news/2009/03/25/harrow-psychic-under-investigation-116451-23230685/

Interesting but what is the point of reminding him about the cancer act again when we know he will say any old BS in front of an audience.

In that programme last night, right at the start, he was telling a woman that she might get healed just sitting in the audience. This man will say anything to keep the charade going. If TS had any sense of responsibility they would persue him vigorously.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

I posted this over at BadPsychics as well, it's a good example of how people will believe what they want to believe.

Comments from Gary's facebook. First one is a classic.

From 'Kirsten'


Thank you for accepting my friends request - like many others, I saw the program and want to congratulate you on standing your ground.
In my opinion, if you've cured the symptoms then you've done people a great service, unlike so many in the 'medical profession' who are just out to make as much as they can for as little time as they can, caring little for their patients and only for a fast turnaround.
Kudos to you, Sir, and respect to your spirit guide.

'Liz':


Thought programme was good and well done you for standing your ground. Wanted to say that as soon as I saw the beginning I knew you were the real deal. So young to have such responsibility. Guess you can handle it. Also wanted to let you know that for several weeks I have been suffering with pain in my left hip during the night. Last night was the first night I slept without the pain, sure Abraham's energy had something to do with that. With much love Liz Gilmour, no you don't know me but know a lot of people you know.

'Sally'


hi Gary dont worrry hun focus on the good you do for people thats all you need to do anyway love if you are earning 2 grand a week how about asking Abraham if he liked to work with me for a bit ya greedy bugga !!! love ya loads the good bits were fab and they were the only bits i watched see you soon xxxx

'Maggie'


hang in there love some of these things are sent to try us
and you know the truth thats all that matters
keep up the good work you know your worth

'Karen'


could have been so much worse overallI think you came out looking honest and knew what you were talking about...nothing tha guy tried to throw at you put you off or caught you out...well done =o)
p.s keep your hair long it suits ya x

'Eileen'


As soon as I saw the title I knew what was coming prejudice is alive and well within the media if they could they would relegate us back to pre 1951 and drive us underground!

'Tracy'


Yeah I have to admit I watched it expecting it to be worse to be honest, think its probably one of the most balanced of the docs have seen on our world, but still had a few "oh for godsake" moments why do they bother hey? Gary I dont give 2 hoots about the prog, you are a fantastic healer, and the responses from people who you have seen when you ... Read Morecome over here as well as my own thoughts just proove that. With all the footage they actually filmed they must have been half asleep when they were picking what they used what about interviewing those who were having something done on the demo, eg the lady who was moving her arm about, instead of the ones who just watched.

'Colin'


Hey Gary - couldn't wait until tomorrow to watch the program so watched it this morning before work. I think despite the BBC's best efforts to prove you fraudulent (as they do with virtually anything remotely psychic) they didn't do a very good job. The title of the program itself shows their or somebody's complete ignorance and lack of education... Read More and knowledge into the subject. Also highlights and demonstrates that their soul isn't ready to experience or to begin to understand that kind of information as yet. As for us and many others in the movement we have been here many many times before and now have that knowledge and understanding as part of our soul's progression. Anyway enough waffling - but well done! I've burned it to DVD and for all the people I emailed in our circle to watch it who couldn't, I shall be giving them the DVD to see :o)

'Amy'


I know you must get hundreds of messages!
But I just watched you on BBC3 and I think you are amazing!
I'm so interested in spiritual healing, and would like to become a healer myself!
I think what you are doing is awesome, and as long as you are relieving people from pain and helping people, screw the sceptics!
Keep up with the good work!


Predictably the believers don't want to face up to the fact their messiah is a very naughty boy.

[bindeweede]

Interesting but what is the point of reminding him about the cancer act again when we know he will say any old BS in front of an audience.

In that programme last night, right at the start, he was telling a woman that she might get healed just sitting in the audience. This man will say anything to keep the charade going. If TS had any sense of responsibility they would persue him vigorously.

He said the same thing last February at St James's church - people have been known to be healed just from being in the same room as him.

Staggering arrogance.

[polomint38]

He said the same thing last February at St James's church - people have been known to be healed just from being in the same room as him.

Staggering arrogance.

I feel better just reading about him on this thread :cheesy:

Sorry taken my pills much better now O0

[Mulder]

Having finally watched the TV programme, I thought it interesting how 'Abraham' had the final word when Gary was faced with negative feedback. I'm going to look out for that effect with other mediums.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Another review:

http://www.tvscoop.tv/2009/03/tv_review_gary.html

[Trinoc]

Interesting to read reviews that support my skepticism ... but are there any that come down firmly on the credulous side (Gary's own blog and and the usual believer forums excepted)?

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Probably not, because anyone not usually exposed to the weirdness of these beliefs would instantly jump to the conclusions that what is going on is complete nonsense.

[bindeweede]

He has used the term "psychic surgery" for so long, but now it's


Also a demonstration of PSYCHIC HEALING with GARY MANNION Not that it makes much difference.


Woodbridge Mind Body Spirit Festival - Now in its 9th year

On Saturday 4th & Sunday 5th April 2009- 10am-5pm http://suffolk.thespiritguides.co.uk/EventsComments.aspx?e=2754&p=47&Redirect=Psychic_Events.aspx

[Mulder]

When I think of psychic surgery I think of blood and people apparently pushing their hands into bodies. What Gary does is pretty tame really.

[bindeweede]

When I think of psychic surgery I think of blood and people apparently pushing their hands into bodies. What Gary does is pretty tame really.

Miracles tame??


New workshops include Gary Mannion with his guide Abraham will be performing non-invasive Psychic Surgery on willing members of the audience. Expect a miracle!

(From links on http://www.garymannion.com/)

[Mulder]

Just noticed Gary looks like a younger Timothy Geithner ... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7966023.stm

Spooky!

[chaggle]

Just noticed Gary looks like a younger Timothy Geithner ... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7966023.stm

Spooky!

Frighteningly similar!

[Julia]

I've just added a short article to the Mannion site:

http://jonn.co.uk/garymannion/modules/news/article.php?storyid=60 (http://jonn.co.uk/garymannion/modules/news/article.php?storyid=60)

Remember his claim to have worked "one on one" with problem children at the age of 17? Surprise, surprise, he didn't - not in Harrow, anyway!

[bindeweede]

There seems to be a new group on Facebook.....


Please can all those who believe in Gary join my group GARY MANNION IS GENUINE - thank you, we need to show him our support. THANK YOU XX

It's probably me but there just seems hint of desperation? And a lack of evidence, of course.

Won't be signing up:cheesy:.

[Dubious Dick]

Shall we start up a 'Gary Mannion channeling Abrham is a dead ringer impersonation of Colin Fry channeling Magnus' Facebook page?

Subtitled 'What a load of old cobblers, INNIT!'

[bindeweede]

There seems to be a new group on Facebook.....



It's probably me but there just seems hint of desperation? And a lack of evidence, of course.

Won't be signing up:cheesy:.

From that group....


Gary has always been a genuine, kind and amazing person, he has given his life to attempt help and heal people with the guidance of Abraham and I feel it's time the people who believe in him join together and show their support for him and his dedication to his work."Given his life"? He has just bleedin turned 21! "Dedication to his work"? - dedication to conning gullible people out of their money, I would suggest.

Sad folk.

[bindeweede]

Shall we start up a 'Gary Mannion channeling Abrham is a dead ringer impersonation of Colin Fry channeling Magnus' Facebook page?

Subtitled 'What a load of old cobblers, INNIT!'

DD, if this clip is what you are referring to, I think you have a good point.;D

GrV7A3RECJA

[bindeweede]

George Gregg has recently posted these comments on Facebook.



In 1981 Wilson and Barber first identified what they called a fantasy-prone personality (FPP) type (this work actually extended from Josephine Hilgard’s observations of people who were very susceptible to hypnosis). These are people who not only lead a rich fantasy life but seem to blur the lines between fantasy and reality. They identify 14 characteristics of fantasy proneness: (1) being an excellent hypnotic subject, (2) having imaginary playmates as a child, (3) fantasizing frequently as a child, (4) adopting a fantasy identity, (5) experiencing imagined sensations as real, (6) having vivid sensory perceptions, (7) reliving past experiences, (8) claiming psychic powers, (9) having out-of-body or floating experiences, (10) receiving poems, messages, etc., from spirits, higher intelligences, and the like, (11) being involved in “healing,” (12) encountering apparitions, (13) experiencing hypnagogic hallucinations (waking dreams), and (14) seeing classical hypnagogic imagery (such as spirits or monsters from outer space).He adds that diagnosis of FPP requires 6 of the 14 characteristics.

He continues...

(2) having imaginary playmates as a child, (3) fantasizing frequently as a child, (4) adopting a fantasy identity, (5) experiencing imagined sensations as real, (6) having vivid sensory perceptions, (8) claiming psychic powers, (10) receiving poems, messages, etc., from spirits, higher intelligences, and the like, (11) being involved in “healing,” (12) encountering apparitions, (13) experiencing hypnagogic hallucinations (waking dreams), and (14) seeing classical hypnagogic imagery (such as spirits or monsters from outer space).

I think after watching the BBC 3 film he has 11/14 thus fitting the FFP criterion.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3746620

Anyone want to comment? It is an area I know nothing about.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1405185303#/topic.php?uid=64394076274&topic=8592

[Admin]

Fantasy-prone personality is a possibility but it's always dubious practise to try to diagnose people online!

I've attached the paper linked to on PubMed for members to read.

If you don't understand statistics, just ignore those bits. You can get a good idea of what a paper is about by reading the introduction (where background info and the rationale for the study is usually given) and the discussion (where the results are considered in the context of the introduction).

Reading primary source material like research papers is a good thing to do when you can get a hold of them but always remember, they are written by experts for their peers. So don't think that by reading such a paper you become qualified to start designating people personality types, diagnosing mental illnesses etc. just because you've read a paper.

Just treat them as informative research material.

[bindeweede]

Fantasy-prone personality is a possibility but it's always dubious practise to try to diagnose people online!

I've attached the paper linked to on PubMed for members to read.

If you don't understand statistics, just ignore those bits. You can get a good idea of what a paper is about by reading the introduction (where background info and the rationale for the study is usually given) and the discussion (where the results are considered in the context of the introduction).

Reading primary source material like research papers is a good thing to do when you can get a hold of them but always remember, they are written by experts for their peers. So don't think that by reading such a paper you become qualified to start designating people personality types, diagnosing mental illnesses etc. just because you've read a paper.

Just treat them as informative research material.

John

Thanks for that - I've saved the document and will tackle it tomorrow.

Just to clarify, I wouldn't dream of trying to identify personality types or diagnosing mental illness because I had read, and probably not fully understood a paper.

[Admin]

Just to clarify, I wouldn't dream of trying to identify personality types or diagnosing mental illness because I had read, and probably not fully understood a paper.

The comment wasn't aimed at you (or even anyone on here). O0

It's just a general comment as you do sometimes get people who discover things on Wikipedia etc. about personality disorders and such like and then start diagnosing other people online!

[Mulder]

I'm a bit disturbed that experiencing the paranormal is included as a 'symptom' of being fantasy-prone. These experiences are generally explainable without any need to invoke particular personality types. In my experience, there isn't a 'typical' paranormal witness 'type'.

Once upon a time witnesses were reluctant to report their experiences for fear of being labelled 'mad'. Now we have the opposite situation where people can't wait to get in tiuch with their local rag for their 15 minutes of fame. It would be a pity if we regressed to the earlier situation by implying experiencers may be fantasy-prone, which inevitably makes them sound a naive and maybe stupid.

It occurs to me that a common factor in many of the symptoms is a tendency to attribute subjective experiences to external, independent agencies. Maybe that is a better indicator than belief in the paranormal.

[Mojo]

I'm a bit disturbed that experiencing the paranormal is included as a 'symptom' of being fantasy-prone. These experiences are generally explainable without any need to invoke particular personality types. In my experience, there isn't a 'typical' paranormal witness 'type'.
It's the interpretation of the experience rather than the experience itself that's relevant. A tendency to interpret experiences as "paranormal" rather than look for a more mundane explanation probably says something about a person's personality.

[GaryMannion]

Nice to see your all still so well!

69 pages wow you lot really do like a gossip!

What nonsense are you talking about now? Probally check back again in another few months!

[Trinoc]

What nonsense are you talking about now?
Still yours ...

[Admin]

Still yours ...

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Perfect response!

[Mulder]

Nice to see your all still so well!

69 pages wow you lot really do like a gossip!

What nonsense are you talking about now? Probally check back again in another few months!

Hi Gary, I saw you on TV the other day. Nice show! I was disappointed not to see the blood associated with traditional 'psychic surgery'. It seemed to me that what you do looked no different from any other psychic healer (who do not claim to perform any kind of surgery).

So how is what you do 'surgery'? Have you any evidence that anything physical happens internally to your patients?

[Julia]

Hiya, Gary!

What did Brent and Harrow Trading Standards have to say to you last week? By the way, I was pleased to see that in the brochure for an upcoming Mind/Body/Spirit fair you no longer name your "leading medical professionals" Dr Gowri Motha, Manesh Naidoo and Glen Davies. I'm sure Trading Standards will also be pleased that you've dropped what they called "this misrepresentation". However, I don't think the names Archie Roy, Patricia Robertson and Harry Oldfield will cut much ice. By the way, is Harry Oldfield still claiming to have worked as a visiting Professor of Medicine at the non-existant "University of Grenada"?

Love and light,

Julia

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Nice to see your all still so well!

69 pages wow you lot really do like a gossip!

What nonsense are you talking about now? Probally check back again in another few months!

Come back when you've got some evidence mate.

[bindeweede]

What nonsense are you talking about now?

When it comes to talking nonsense Gary, you are an expert. Did you actually watch Emeka's film - you know, that bit where Abraham, the 4 thousand year old Jewish prophet from another planet spoke to Emeka through you, in English, in a posh English accent, making the same sort of grammatical errors as you do.

Now, there we have total and utter nonsense.;D;D;D

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Or the bit when you were pushing a glass around on that table with your finger?

Ho ho ho ;D

You do know how gullible your workshop participants are, don't you? 8)

[Julia]

Gary, do you still intend to teach "levitation" at your workshops? You do realize that your version is just a parlour trick?

[SimonC]

I thought your programme was great, Gary! I've been discussing 'spiritual healing' with a mate - he said he wasn't convinced either way. After watching your documentary, he concluded that you are a "money-grabbing charlatan". Does that count as 'healing'?

Well done - your idiocy on tv was much more effective than any skeptical argument. O0

The 'chanelling Abraham' bit was priceless. ;D

[bindeweede]

Hi Gary, I saw you on TV the other day. Nice show! I was disappointed not to see the blood associated with traditional 'psychic surgery'. It seemed to me that what you do looked no different from any other psychic healer (who do not claim to perform any kind of surgery).

So how is what you do 'surgery'? Have you any evidence that anything physical happens internally to your patients?

Well, "Fleur" has external evidence of Psychic surgery, which really confuses me, as I thought there were no incisions. But I must be wrong.


I have had healing from Gary and it is an incredible experience, totally genuine. I also have pictures of the scars that formed on my back afterwards as proof (not for myself) that something did take place and it really was a beautiful, gentle and awe-inspiring journey.Doubt link will work, but....

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=5601923293&nctrct=1238717470275#/topic.php?uid=5601923293&topic=7756

[Dubious Dick]

Hello Gary,

Well, that was certainly a useful and informative post.

I started to try to give you some benefit of the doubt as to whether you actually believe what you are doing, but it all went up in smoke when you 'channelled' Abraham. You started out by implying Abraham is real, then you backtracked a bit saying he may just be a construct in your head, then you 'channelled' him. All extremely contradictory.

As for the chennelling itself. Well, it really did bear a remarkable resemblance to Colin 'trumpet waver' Fry and his Magnus character. Have you seen that? Very funny really. There was also a complete loon from the U.S. on a Louis Theroux a while back who 'channelled' an alien. Again, remarkable similarities.

You could not provide a shred of evidence on the documentary. You promised then failed to give Emeka the names of the so called medical professionals you work with.

The inconsistencies now add up to a considerable weight of evidence that you are a complete and utterly shameless fraud. Now, here's a warning. You are being watched very carefully. If you step out of line even one little bit and break any law, we will be on to you. I suggest that you tread very carefully indeed. In fact, it may well be a wise decision for you to go back into the home improvement business (where you were apparently very successful before), and where there is less danger to you of legal action (unless it is dodgy double glazing).

You may think that even though you are a fraud, you do indeed offer hope and comfort to people. Do try to stop and think for a moment though. How would you like it if someone offered false hope to someone you love? False hope is not hope at all. It is worse than no hope!

[Julia]

I occurs to me that he's really taking this feud with Julia too far. It's one thing to punish all of us at UK skeptics by witholding evidence in retalliation for Julia's unfair expose of his lies and evassions but quite another to withold evidence from a documentary, a year later. I mean he didn't even give Emeka the names of the medical proffessionals he's worked with.

Matt, I was very annoyed that Emeka's documentary left viewers with the impression that Gary didn't name those "leading medical professionals" because they'd been harrassed by sceptics (ie me)!

[SorryImPsychic]

Nice to see your all still so well!

69 pages wow you lot really do like a gossip!

...and let's see the mileage they get from your recent gem of a post. O0

[scherben]

The prophet Abraham

1. Wasn't a surgeon

2. Probably didn't exist as a historical figure

3. Would know divination is decried by the God he submitted to

I presume he operates through 'Platonic' forms?

[bindeweede]

I wonder if this forum is included in the "other unhealthily aggressive websites", like BadPsychics? The article was written by Jane Tribble, who describes herself .

I am a broadcaster and consumer journalist with many years’ experience dealing with crooks and Gary is not a crook.I have no idea if Gary has disappeared - certainly www.garymannion.com (http://www.garymannion.com) and
www.divinemessengers.com (http://www.divinemessengers.com) have been down for over a week, and he is not saying much on Facebook.

Perhaps, there has been more negative publicity following the documentary than at first it appeared.

http://skeptic.org.uk/news/2008/901

(Last item)

[MischiefMonkey]

I wonder if this forum is included in the "other unhealthily aggressive websites", like BadPsychics? The article was written by Jane Tribble, who describes herself .
I have no idea if Gary has disappeared - certainly www.garymannion.com (http://www.garymannion.com) and
www.divinemessengers.com (http://www.divinemessengers.com) have been down for over a week, and he is not saying much on Facebook.

Perhaps, there has been more negative publicity following the documentary than at first it appeared.

http://skeptic.org.uk/news/2008/901

(Last item)


Unless she is Sarah Jane Tribble, I can find nothing on google. Which would be unusual for a "broadcaster and consumer journalist"

That said, I'm pants at Google.

[bindeweede]

I see that Dubious Dick has already replied to that post - God, he is fast!!



Dear Jane Tribble,
Delighted to hear that your tumour has shrunk. As good skeptics we will be absolutely thrilled if you can provide any evidence at all, other than personal testimony which has no value whatsoever, that Gary Mannion achieved this ‘miracle’ via his so called ‘psychic surgery’.
While considering your reply you will of course include all the information regarding ongoing treatment by other means.
Thank you,
DD
P.S. Can you please provide you CV regards your background as a Journalist i.e. do you have any scientific or medical expereince that would qualify you to judge the success of the so called ‘psychic surgery’?I'm not great with searches either, but will try.

[Trinoc]

Unless she is Sarah Jane Tribble, I can find nothing on google. Which would be unusual for a "broadcaster and consumer journalist"
That's the trouble with Tribbles ... :smiley:

[Matt]

The Sarah Jane Tribble (Doctor Who/Star Trek crossover?) who pops up in searches appears to be US based.

Yet the Jane Tribble on the JREF is talking in pounds sterling.

[Croydon Bob]

A search for Jane Tribble -Sarah gets hits but nothing that leaped out at me before I got bored (after 30 seconds).

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Maybe the pressure and expectation on Gary from all the people constantly proclaiming how exceptionally gifted he is has got to him? Maybe he needs a break from all the sycophants?

Or maybe, like the two days a week when Abraham 'goes away' at the moment, Abraham has gone away for a bit longer this time. i.e. Gary just can't be arsed with it all for a while.

[polomint38]

Maybe the pressure and expectation on Gary from all the people constantly proclaiming how exceptionally gifted he is has got to him? Maybe he needs a break from all the sycophants?

Or maybe, like the two days a week when Abraham 'goes away' at the moment, Abraham has gone away for a bit longer this time. i.e. Gary just can't be arsed with it all for a while.

Maybe he has got his nice nest egg and doesn't need to lie any more O0

[Ryoden]

That's actually quite freaky, I just finished watching Gary chanelling Abraham and Colin chanelling Magnus and it's true...

They are both in fact chanelling Alec Guiness:cheesy:

[bindeweede]

They are both in fact (well, insert a number of words - go on -use your imagination!)

[Ryoden]

Gary isnt a chiropracter as well is he? I just noticed that all his websites seem to be down :tongue:

[bindeweede]

I've never seen Gary offer chiropractic - well, there is a regulatory body after all. Gary only offers unregulated stuff - hypnotherapy, psychic surgery, clairvoyance, mediumship, etc.

Yes his two sites have been down for a month or so. He also cancelled a demonstration of "trance" last Monday. He seems to be very quiet at the moment.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

That's actually quite freaky, I just finished watching Gary chanelling Abraham and Colin chanelling Magnus and it's true...

They are both in fact chanelling Alec Guiness:cheesy:

It's the same act. Only the most gullible of beleivers can think something is going on there other than a grown man putting on a false voice.

And if someone feels the need to act in such an openly fraudulent and devious way, then why not question all their other extraordinary claims.

Only in the world of believers can you pick and choose what you want to believe depending on how much it corresponds with your own belief system.

[bindeweede]

One of Mannion's sites is back up, but there is very little info atm..

But the "Guestbook" page is worth a look.;D

http://www.garymannion.com/

[bindeweede]

One of Mannion's sites is back up, but there is very little info atm..

But the "Guestbook" page is worth a look.;D

http://www.garymannion.com/

I wonder why he is promoting a Ghost Festival. The


Psychic Surgeon, Indigo Child Specialist,
Founder of the A.B.E Healing method,
Desperation?

http://www.garymannion.com/

Bottom of the list.

And can anyone find any information about the A.B.E. Healing Method?

I can't. He might think we have forgotten.:cheesy:

[bindeweede]

I wonder if there is someone who can save the page for posterity. I can't seem to do it.

[Trinoc]

Bloody flash pages -- very hard to save!

If you just want to save what you see on the screen, press "Print Screen", open an image editor or word processor, and paste in the image from the clipboard.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Mannion is friendly with Ian John Shillito who founded London Paranormal.

[bindeweede]

That's interesting.


Originally from Braintree in Essex, Ian John Shillito, is a sensitive and ghost hunter.

http://www.paranormalunited.com/ianshillito.htm

Got to find out what a "sensitive" is, now.

Ah,....


Sensitives come with various levels and types of extra-sensory perceptions which include abilities to gather knowledge and information through methods not yet fully understood or recognized by science which include:

* clairsentience - feeling
* clairalience - smelling
* clairaudience - hearing
* claircognizance - knowing
* clairgustance - tasting
* clairvoyance - seeing

~ Some sensitives may possess just one of these abilities, while others may have three or even all abilities.All the usual, then.

http://www.teamrenfrewshireghosthunters.com/sensitive-f21/what-is-a-sensitive-t49.htm

[bindeweede]

Are his talents limitless? ABE used to stand for Abraham's Body Energy healing system. Now it's "Action Based Entertainment" - Mannion is to be a DJ on his new radio station.

http://www.abefm.moonfruit.com/#


Our main approach is from the Alternative World and our shows Features DJ's such as Gary Mannion and DJ LP who will be covering all topics from Healing, Health the Paranormal, Psychics and even general things on everyones minds. All our Alternaitive shows also come with some of the best music going. Our Dj's have selected some of their favourites that fit in with their shows and when their not on the station will continue to play non stop music

[Trinoc]

They forgot to list "clairfraudulence".

(I think our own JJ may have coined that one.)

(Edit: Ah yes ... http://www.ukskeptics.com/forum/showthread.php?p=42084&highlight=clairfraudulence#post42084, and I see he mentioned it earlier in this thread as well.)

(Oh, and "clairflatulence" ... http://www.ukskeptics.com/forum/showthread.php?p=42124&highlight=clairflatulence#post42124.)

[Mulder]

Mannion is friendly with Ian John Shillito who founded London Paranormal.

Looking at the London Paranormal website gives me a weird feeling. Here is a subject that has been my passion for decades now being sold as a commodity. For most of the time that I've been actively investigating ghosts, the public hardly noticed. I was considered a bit odd for even being interested. Now it is a paid-for 'experience', popular with charity groups and work outings.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Are his talents limitless? ABE used to stand for Abraham's Body Energy healing system. Now it's "Action Based Entertainment" - Mannion is to be a DJ on his new radio station.

http://www.abefm.moonfruit.com/#

Has he given up trying to heal the world? First Michael Jackson, now Gary Mannion. Who is left to save us? Oh, Nina Knowland probably.:undecided:

[bindeweede]

Tricia Robertson, who runs an evening class in Psychical Research at Glasgow University's Department of Adult and Continuing Education, has recently given a lecture presenting the results of her research into Mannion's "healing" abilities. Here are two interesting snippets.


The healer Gary Mannion was investigated from April 2009, and a research protocol was developed for him. This differed slightly from that for Nina, because Gary had stated that the several healers who worked through him claimed to diagnose disorders from within patients' bodies. Nina made no such statement. Three of Gary's past patients were interviewed; other patients offered signed testimonies, all responding very positively as to the effectiveness of Gary's healing.And


Of 41 of Gary's patients:



40% felt some manipulation within their bodies
50% reported heat during healing
20% reported a sensation of stiching within their bodies
30% felt some emotional release
44% had some improvement after one healing


None of Gary's patients in Glasgow knew any of Nina's patients, though all described sensations similar to those described by Nina's patients.

Eighty patients had so far been investigated, and work was continuing. Many different disorders were treated. Spinal conditions seem to respond particularly well to healing.

Although many patients were reluctant to give written testimonies, there were x-ray confirmations of conditions before and after healing in some cases.I wonder how many patients were reluctant to give testimonies, and why.

More here.

http://spiritlove.freeforums.org/post32236.html#p32236

[Drop Bear]

Do I believe in fairies?

Well, I did,but sadly that is no longer the case.

I need to take you back to 1972. I had this brilliant friend, who was unfortunately also as mad as a march hare. (didn't realise at the time)

Anyway,he showed me what were at that time unpublished photos of the Cottingley Fairies,explaining breathlessly that KODAC had declared them genuine and that no less a person than Sir Arthur Conan Doyel declared the photos to be genuine,and had writen a book "The Coming Of The Fairies" (there have been two films of which I'm aware based on the events made in the last few years)

Imagine my surprise when one of the girls,in extreme old age, confessed to faking the photos, explaining how they did it. Seems obvious looking at the photos today in the age of photoshop,but probably less so in 1917.

Context: At that time the obscenity of WW 1 was still in full gore mode. Tens of thousands of people mourning their losses were desperate to believe in' something more' ( I understand Conan Doyle lost a son,which perhaps also explains his deep interest in spiritualism)

There is a brief excerpt from the Wikipedia article below.The entire article is worth reading,in my opinion.



00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000


[QUOTE]
Conan Doyle's involvement

Sir Arthur Conan Doyle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Arthur_Conan_Doyle), a prominent Spiritualist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritualism_%28religious_movement%29), had been commissioned by the Strand Magazine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strand_Magazine) to write an article on fairies for their Christmas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas) issue, to be published at the end of November 1920. He was preparing this in June when he heard of the two prints of fairies, made contact with Gardner and borrowed copies of the prints.
He showed the prints to Sir Oliver Lodge (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Oliver_Lodge), a pioneer psychical researcher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychical_research), who thought them to be fakes, perhaps involving a troupe of dancers masquerading (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masquerading) as fairies. One fairy authority told him that the hairstyles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hairstyle) of the sprites were too 'Parisienne' for his liking. Lodge also passed them on to a clairvoyant (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clairvoyant) for psychometric (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychometry_%28paranormal%29) impressions.
Conan Doyle dispatched Gardner to Cottingley in July. Gardner reported that the whole Wright family seemed honest and totally respectable. Conan Doyle and Gardner decided that if further fairy photographs were taken then the matter would be firmly put beyond question. Gardner journeyed north in August with cameras and 20 photographic plates (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photographic_plate) to leave with Elsie and Frances hoping to persuade them to take more photographs. Only in this way, he felt, could it be proved that the fairies were genuine.
Meanwhile, the Strand article was completed, featuring the two reprinted, better defined prints. Conan Doyle sailed for Australia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia), and a lecture tour designed to spread the gospel of Spiritualism. He left his colleagues to face public reactions to the fairy controversy.
That issue of the Strand sold out within days of publication at the end of November. Reaction was vigorous, especially from critics. The leading voice among them was that of Major Hall-Edwards (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Major_Hall-Edwards&action=edit&redlink=1), a radium (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radium) expert. He declared:
“ On the evidence I have no hesitation in saying that these photographs could have been 'faked'. I criticize the attitude of those who declared there is something supernatural in the circumstances attending to the taking of these pictures because, as a medical man, I believe that the inculcation of such absurd ideas into the minds of children will result in later life in manifestations and nervous disorder and mental disturbances… ” Newspaper comments were varied. On 5 January 1921, Truth declared:
“ For the true explanation of these fairy photographs what is wanted is not a knowledge of occult phenomena but a knowledge of children. ” On the other hand the South Wales Argus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Wales_Argus) of 27 November 1920 took a more tolerant view:
“ The day we kill our Santa Claus with our statistics we shall have plunged a glorious world into deepest darkness ” City News, on 29 January, stated:
“ It seems at this point that we must either believe in the almost incredible mystery of the fairy or in the almost incredible wonders of faked photographs. ” The Westminster Gazette broke the aliases used by Conan Doyle to protect Frances and Elsie and a reporter went north. However, nothing new was added to the story by the reporter's investigation. He found out that Elsie had borrowed her father's camera to take the first picture, and that Frances had taken a picture of Elsie and a gnome. In fact there was nothing he could add to the facts listed by Conan Doyle in his article "Fairies photographed–an epoch making event". The reporter considered Polly and Arthur Wright to be honest enough folk and he returned a verdict of 'unexplained' to his paper in London.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cottingley_fairies

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

50% reported heat during healing

Classic case where some blinding under controlled conditions would be extremely interesting.

I can't help but think as I read those excerpts, that it's all a bit pointless. Some properly blinded testing would be far more illuminating. Has she ever heard that some conditions can some times get better on their own?

[bindeweede]

Has she ever heard that some conditions can some times get better on their own?

I shouldn't really. Just over a week ago I was on hols in the Algarve. Walking back from a restaurant I had a bad fall - not tipsy, rough footpath. I lost about a square inch of skin on my right wrist - down to the flesh. Horrible. Do you know, a week later, new skin has grown and although it is still sore and itchy, the wound is about a tenth of the original size, and no reiki, crystals, magnets, homeotripe, religion, or (please don't make me laugh), psychic surgery involved. The only "magic" involved? - water, Germolene and Elastoplast.

[rainbows.]

You really ought to be more careful while practicing your Tipi Yoga :-*

http://www.consciousliving.co.uk/

[bindeweede]

You really ought to be more careful while practicing your Tipi Yoga :-*

http://www.consciousliving.co.uk/


Holistic therapies available

Massage: from 45 Euros
Spiritual healing: 35 Euros
Crystal healing: 35 Euros
Medicine card & Tarot readings: 20 Euros

rainbows, I love your sense of humour.:ob:

[rainbows.]

And i love yours.

http://media.photobucket.com/image/mad%20as%20a%20march%20hare/undeadmoose/MadMarchHARE.png?o=2

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

What's Mannion up to these days? Still coining it in and evading tax?

[Nasib]

What's Mannion up to these days? Still coining it in and evading tax?

His new site is rather evasive. ::)

http://www.parallelmanagement.co.uk/2010/02/10/gary-mannion/


Wesite: www. psychicsurgeongary .com
Speciality: Psychic Healing
Credit Card Hotline: 08000 673 761
Pre-Paid Readings: 0906 176 3761

Psychic Surgeon a rare industry

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

I was thinking about this again today, I just cannot get my head around how, if I had the ability to psychically heal people, I would not spend every minute of every day of the rest of my life bringing relief to people. Doing good to relieve suffering and only for living expenses.

Imagine the job satisfaction. It would be amazing.

[Matt]

I was thinking about this again today, I just cannot get my head around how, if I had the ability to psychically heal people, I would not spend every minute of every day of the rest of my life bringing relief to people. Doing good to relieve suffering and only for living expenses.

Imagine the job satisfaction. It would be amazing.

And if you substitute "psychically" with "medically" does this affect the argument?

[skbuncks]

I was thinking about this again today, I just cannot get my head around how, if I had the ability to psychically heal people, I would not spend every minute of every day of the rest of my life bringing relief to people. Doing good to relieve suffering and only for living expenses.

Imagine the job satisfaction. It would be amazing.

If you could actually heal people I would have no problem with you earning a salary comparable to a nurse/doctor/surgeon (delete as necessary dependent upon the level of your powers).

skb

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

And if you substitute "psychically" with "medically" does this affect the argument?

But we know psychic healing is superior to medical? None of those nasty chemicals of anything. It's just the whole special powers thing, you'd be special and want to use it to the best of your ability. Anyone can train to be a doctor or nurse.


If you could actually heal people I would have no problem with you earning a salary comparable to a nurse/doctor/surgeon (delete as necessary dependent upon the level of your powers).

skb

If the govt was willing to pay me a lot of money then great. Especially if it came from the cost savings of not needing a few consultants or surgeons as I'd be bring the waiting lists down quicker than anyone in history.

[Matt]

But we know psychic healing is superior to medical? None of those nasty chemicals of anything. It's just the whole special powers thing, you'd be special and want to use it to the best of your ability. Anyone can train to be a doctor or nurse..

Playing dawkins advocate for a bit, if anyone can train to be a doctor or a nurse then that means that you too have this ability to heal people medically. Have you devoted your life to doing so for free?

[skbuncks]

But we know psychic healing is superior to medical? None of those nasty chemicals of anything. It's just the whole special powers thing, you'd be special and want to use it to the best of your ability. Anyone can train to be a doctor or nurse.
Would you? It would take a pretty selfless person to do so. If in possession of said powers, (or indeed any supernatural powers) I would use them primarily for personal gain and maybe appease my conscience with weekly visits to the children's ward for a mass free healing session.

skb

[skbuncks]

Playing dawkins advocate for a bit, if anyone can train to be a doctor or a nurse then that means that you too have this ability to heal people medically. Have you devoted your life to doing so for free?

I see no reason why if one was to possess this attitude towards an ability to heal that it should not also apply to any ability, be in paranormal or not.
So, (@farside) should a talented brick layer use his skills to the best of his ability and build houses for the poor for free?

skb

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

I see no reason why if one was to possess this attitude towards an ability to heal that it should not also apply to any ability, be in paranormal or not.
So, (@farside) should a talented brick layer use his skills to the best of his ability and build houses for the poor for free?

skb

The way I would look at it is that the celebrity and ego-fulfilling opportunities of being so special with built-in super-powers would be different from just being another nurse or doctor, although I do fully understand your point.

Of course we all know in the end, I would use it for my own ends after the initial novelty has worn off. Who cares about sick people when I can have a 60 inch plasma on the wall.

[JohnnyP]

Hi all

Avid atheist and new member saying hello:)

Normally i am more than happy to read through various articles and forum threads without actually posting myself, but having read through this entire thread i felt compelled to comment. Even though this human vulture has been exposed as the con artist he most definitely is, it seems that your efforts have been in vain as he is still practising his mumbo jumbo and no doubt garnered more "true believers" due to the increased publicity he has recieved. If this is not the case please let me know and i will sleep a little easier tonight:)

As for the people who prop up these types of charlatans, sometimes i feel very sorry for them, sometimes infuriated. And also wonder if a little depakote may be the answer.

What will it take for people to see through this rubbish (if ever)? A public confession of deception by a so called psychic ? If so then i am more than willing to volunteer my "time" to assist in the process;)

Rant over and please keep up the good work

Kind Regards
John

[Julia]

First of all, I would agree that the vast majority of people already strongly inclined to believe in woo are unlikely to change their minds because of a couple of websites. In fact they probably wouldn't visit sceptical sites at all. It's the "undecided" section of the population we're hoping to reach - people who come across Gary's claims, Google his name and are faced with stacks of evidence that he's either deluded or a con artist.

Yes, the TV documentary may have helped to publicize Gary, but it was unlikely to have reached a massive audience. The more discriminating viewer (having used their Google-fu) would have asked themselves questions such as "Why does Abraham sound like Alec Guinness?" or "Why did the film-makers not mention that Gary has received official warnings from two Trading Standards offices?". (The answer to the latter question is of course that "It was a typical example of gutless journalism".)

There was never any possibility that Gary would slink away into obscurity. He knows perfectly well that there's a huge market for his brand of nonsense and that there's a sucker born every minute. But if sceptics hadn't intervened he'd STILL be claiming to cure cancer, to have the support of "leading medical professionals" - including a non-existant Head of Physiotherapy at a London hospital - and telling people that Brain Gym can "remove" ADD and Asperger's. I'd certainly call it a positive result that if he tries any of these stunts again he'll be facing legal action.

All we can do is to ensure that as much factual information as possible about the likes of Gary Mannion and Adrian Pengelly is made available to the public.

[bindeweede]

Nice irony?

"Gary Mannions Enlightenment Show"

http://theenlightenmentshow.moonfruit.com/#/exhibitors/4540767326

I see Danny Barker is now a "Psychic Medium" -
wishing to help and assist people who are looking for guidance in all areas of there lives.

Last time I saw him, he was Mannion's porter. And Danny's Mum, Susan, offers Reflexology. which can
help the body's natural balance by unblocking energy pathways that flow throughout the body.

What you would expect, really.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Forever the entrepreneur ::)

Bit tight not to even bother paying for a proper domain name. Even my wife's small business manages to work out how to stop the .moonfruit bit appearing. What a plank.

[rainbows.]

My Aspie son would tell him where to get off if he offered to removed his Aspergers.
He doesn't think there is anything wrong with him. And nor do i ! >:-)

[Matt]

What will it take for people to see through this rubbish (if ever)? A public confession of deception by a so called psychic ? If so then i am more than willing to volunteer my "time" to assist in the process;)


Such a medium M Lamar Keena (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Lamar_Keene) has already made a very public and detailed confession in his book The Psychic Mafia (http://www.scribd.com/doc/3748334/The-Psychic-Mafia) You'll find the full out of print text at that link. It's compulsory reading. There will be a test later ;) Hop to it young padawan.

[bindeweede]

I was surprised by the huge amounts made by Keene and his partner in the 1960's - large amounts even today. The section I found most interesting was Chapter 5 - "Secrets of the Seance". He explains the mostly simple tricks with floating trumpets, billet-reading, ectoplasm, levitation, "apports", etc.

It amazes me that so many people seemed to put these conjuring tricks down to "spirit".

Still, I don't suppose these kinds of tricks happen in today's seances. ??

[Julia]

I could be mistaken, but I seem to remember reading that most of the classic Victorian tricks - floating trumpets, self-thumping tambourines, apports etc - are still in use, but only at seances with a carefully vetted (ie "believers only") audience.

[Croydon Bob]

I could be mistaken, but I seem to remember reading that most of the classic Victorian tricks - floating trumpets, self-thumping tambourines, apports etc - are still in use, but only at seances with a carefully vetted (ie "believers only") audience.

Yes. According to Spiritualists they were still in use at Spiritualist meetings as recently as the 1980s and 90s.

Some Spiritualists are less fundy than others and believe in real and fake spiritualism. "Fake" being when there is fake evidence. "Real" being determined by the lack of evidence...

[Nasib]

Some Spiritualists are less fundy than others and believe in real and fake spiritualism. "Fake" being when there is fake evidence. "Real" being determined by the lack of evidence...

http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt136/KellysKoloboks/giggle-1.gif

[dalriada]

I was surprised by the huge amounts made by Keene and his partner in the 1960's - large amounts even today. The section I found most interesting was Chapter 5 - "Secrets of the Seance". He explains the mostly simple tricks with floating trumpets, billet-reading, ectoplasm, levitation, "apports", etc.

It amazes me that so many people seemed to put these conjuring tricks down to "spirit".

Still, I don't suppose these kinds of tricks happen in today's seances. ??

Even today there are Spirit Trumpets On sale at Ebay (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SEANCE-TRUMPET-PHYSICAL-MEDIUMSHIP-SPIRIT-/190398718551?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Health_Beauty_Natural_AlternativeTherapies&hash=item2c54a5e257) and conicidentally (or not) the very same seller also does a nice line in Old/Antique Coins *
and glow-in-the-dark-tape (http://shop.ebay.co.uk/active-spirit/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p4340)

*Just the sort of things which might make a very convincing "apport"...

Or maybe I'm overly suspicious... ::)

[bindeweede]

Mannion "channelling" Abraham is now on Youtube. Oh, my sides are aching.

_Xu1bqSHZSA

The rest of the documentary is here, for those who missed it, or want to be re-entertained, or reminded how poor the programme was.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=young%2C+psychic+and+possesse d&aq=f

[Julia]

Comments are allowed, so let's make the most of it...

[bindeweede]

Now he embarks on "Alphabetical Ailment Advice", starting with bronchitis.

Do pay attention.:wnw:

VwCz6hnj6wA

Correction - he has already dealt with arthritis.

[scroll33]

Yes. According to Spiritualists they were still in use at Spiritualist meetings as recently as the 1980s and 90s.

Some Spiritualists are less fundy than others and believe in real and fake spiritualism. "Fake" being when there is fake evidence. "Real" being determined by the lack of evidence...


Yea this lot are still strapping mediums to chairs (sadly not the electric variety) I'll include the link but please do try to keep a straight face as this is important scientific breakthrough stuff that's going on. ::)


B4On7QA5wPM

[bindeweede]

Now he embarks on "Alphabetical Ailment Advice", starting with bronchitis.

Do pay attention.:wnw:

VwCz6hnj6wA

Correction - he has already dealt with arthritis.

The Great One speaks on arthritis.

bQe5Z5mPF6M

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

It goes without saying he shouldn't really be doing this. But it's Mannion so what else do you expect.

He does appear to be trying to add some legitimacy to these videos by "channelling" legitimate information from somewhere into the first half the the talk, then adding his anecdotal evidence to the second half.

Let's hope he survives his unvaccinated trip to India, but I'm not looking forward to having to sit through any more of this tripe.

[Admin]

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

It is so blatantly obvious that he hasn't got a clue what he's talking about!

"There are 3 classes of drugs given for arthritis..... but I can't pronounce them". ;D

[dalriada]

Remember the Brain Gym that Gary was so fond of back in the mists of time? Clinical Psychologist Paul O'Donoghue from Irish Skeptics, gives it a thorough debunking in this week's Irish Times- worth a read! (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sciencetoday/2010/0812/1224276613773.html)


It might also interest you to know that processed foods do not contain water and that to improve memory and cell communication you should hold water in the mouth for eight seconds, which will ensure that the body and brain recognise the water correctly and can then prioritise where to use it. Wiggling your ears with your fingers stimulates the reticular formation of the brain to tune out distracting sounds and tune into language, and rocking your head back and forth will get more blood to your frontal lobes to improve comprehension and rational thinking!

These claims are made by the originators and practitioners of a system called Brain Gym, which is marketed in more than 80 countries and is aimed at teachers and school children, business people and sports practitioners. According to Ben Goldacre, author of the book Bad Science and columnist with the Guardian newspaper, hundreds of schools in Britain regularly run Brain Gym activities. It is also widely used in the US. Brain Gym Ireland was set up in 2002 by Padraig King. The descriptions of Brain Buttons and water drinking above are taken from tips he provided on RTÉ’s Afternoon Show.

On his website, King states that Brain Gym “is now being used in a large number of schools and colleges throughout Ireland. Hundreds of teachers, classroom assistants, resource teachers, physiotherapists, speech therapists, occupational therapists, nurses and parents have attended courses, seminars and workshops on Brain Gym over the past few years.” These claims appear consistent with the wide usage reported elsewhere.

So what’s the problem? A system with such broad application and claiming such huge success should surely be a cause for celebration? However, Brain Gym and its underlying theoretical foundations have been thoroughly and systematically criticised in the US, UK, Canada and elsewhere...


More at this link....http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sciencetoday/2010/0812/1224276613773.html

[Julia]

The ever-vigilant bindeweede has noticed that Gary has been a naughty boy again. I won't go into details at the moment - suffice it to say that Trading Standards are on the case and will be in touch with Mr Mannion shortly. ^-^

[Mojo]

Yea this lot are still strapping mediums to chairs (sadly not the electric variety) I'll include the link but please do try to keep a straight face as this is important scientific breakthrough stuff that's going on. ::)


B4On7QA5wPM

Does the image it shows before you click on "play" remind anyone else of the title sequence of Blackadder II?

[bindeweede]

The ever-vigilant bindeweede has noticed that Gary has been a naughty boy again. I won't go into details at the moment - suffice it to say that Trading Standards are on the case and will be in touch with Mr Mannion shortly. ^-^

A video testimonial has recently appeared on his site and his Youtube channel.. (I made a brief comment, but it was quickly deleted.)

k8v6QrMi16I&

She was in such pain, she didn't go to a GP, but made it to an MBS show;D And the inevitable miraculous healing occurred.

And what a surprise, Yvette is a psychic/medium/clairvoyant, (or some such tosh), so everyone is going to believe every word she says.:cheesy:

http://www.yvettetamara.com/About.htm

EE, I couldn't make it up. But I think she has.::)

[DrS]

Funny that, he knew exactly where to put his hands when she said she had bad hips. Amazing. I'd be fumbling around for ages! Impressive ...

Mind you, it was only when he "got to her hips" that she felt the pain like a knife before all the hurt disappeared. Wonder where he started, and how long it took to get from hips ... to hips ...:undecided:

[bindeweede]

What kind of *-wit (* please insert missing word of your own choice) would think that a testimonial from a self-proclaimed psychic might add to his credibility as a "psychic surgeon".

Oh God, I've just wet myself laughing. Again.

But I am going away, for some time.