Reiki

[Ginger Rogers]

hmmmmm. So what is it supposed to do exactly? I had this once, what a load of old cobblers! ??

[Jocky]

what is it supposed to do exactly

Part you from your money ;D I can't see any other purpose in it.

It often seems to be marketed alongside massage - which at least has the virtue of doing something which could physically effect you.

[vbloke]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reiki#Criticism

Reiki works in mysterious ways, much like Theraputic Touch, which was debunked by a 9 year old girl.

[Ginger Rogers]

I have to say I didn't have to pay, it was free. it still didn't do anything though! :D

[Admin]

It's a form of 'energy healing' - a.k.a. doing nothing! ;D

If you're unwell it means that your energies are imbalanced and a reiki healer can come and wave their hands around you and re-balance them to make you better. :D

The great thing with reiki is that the healing energy is intelligent! - the healer doesn't need to diagnose the problem because the reiki energy knows what to do.

In fact, reiki energy is so clever that the reiki master can heal someone without even being there. They just send 'remote reiki' instead and it still works!!

It's people's (often very intelligent people's) willingness to believe in something that is quite clearly a load of nonsense that can drive us Skeptics to despair.

[tkingdoll]

It's people's (often very intelligent people's) willingness to believe in something that is quite clearly a load of nonsense that can drive us Skeptics to despair.




Or as I like to put it: Reiki? Crikey!

[vbloke]

I think the single biggest problem we have, not just in this country, but throughout the world, is that science is not good at expressing itself to non scientists.

If science could talk to the common man like the woos manage to, we'd be in a lot better shape.

Another issue I have is that people are intrinsically lazy and follow authority blindly. If a man in a lab coat says jump, people will. Once they've been told things, they won't bother actually going out and reading up on the subject for themselves, they'll just blindly accept what they're told at face value. This is why things like homeopathy and acupuncture are accepted and not questioned - people don't look into it themselves and rely on anecdote and the practitioners themselves to supply the information. meanwhile, all science can do is publish peer-reviewed articles in journals that 99.9% of the population do not read whilst the alt-med people go out and publish booklets and pamphlets and distribute them to all and sundry.

Having a gullible and lazy media doesn't help either.

[Admin]

I agree Mark.

We need an organisation that will take the findings and knowledge of academics and present it to the public in an interesting and understandable way.

Enter UK-Skeptics :angel:

That will be our primary aim from now on.

As for people checking things out for themselves...

I think a lot of people do this but the big problem is that they don't have the skills to do it properly. I cringe when ever I see someone stating that "I don't know if I believe in mediums and I will only be convinced if they can tell me things they couldn't have known".

The point is that unless a person knows how psychics, and the psychology of psychic readings, work then they are leaving themselves wide open to being fooled and drawing a false conclusion.

It's the same with alt. meds. Why is it that people know that reiki/homeopathy/etc. work?

It's because they've tried it for themselves and it worked!

Again though, they are probably not aware of how things can appear to work even when they are bogus.

As Randi always points out: it's not just about understanding how we can be fooled by others, it's about understanding how we can fool ourselves.

[vbloke]

Enter UK-Skeptics :angel:



You need heavenly choral music to accompany that smiley ;D

[Ginger Rogers]

I agree Mark.

We need an organisation that will take the findings and knowledge of academics and present it to the public in an interesting and understandable way.

Enter UK-Skeptics :angel:

That will be our primary aim from now on.

As for people checking things out for themselves...

I think a lot of people do this but the big problem is that they don't have the skills to do it properly. I cringe when ever I see someone stating that "I don't know if I believe in mediums and I will only be convinced if they can tell me things they couldn't have known".

The point is that unless a person knows how psychics, and the psychology of psychic readings, work then they are leaving themselves wide open to being fooled and drawing a false conclusion.

It's the same with alt. meds. Why is it that people know that reiki/homeopathy/etc. work?

It's because they've tried it for themselves and it worked!

Again though, they are probably not aware of how things can appear to work even when they are bogus.

As Randi always points out: it's not just about understanding how we can be fooled by others, it's about understanding how we can fool ourselves.


You make some very interesting points there, and I think that I probably fall into the category of one who isn't aware of how things can appear to work when they are bogus, also i have no idea how psychics, and the psychology of psychic readings, work.

Obviously I don't just believe everything I'm told, or I wouldn't be here lol but I'm not very scientifically knowledgeable at all.

So how do psychics and the psychology of psychic readings work?

by the way, i've never fancied it myself, but I thought acupuncture did actually work??

[seren]

My dad claimed at one point that he could feel heat coming out of his hands and that people felt "healed" when he held his hands over them.

How did he fool himself? He ain't dumb- so what made him think that he had "magic" powers?? Apart from a massively inflated ego?

[Admin]

My dad claimed at one point that he could feel heat coming out of his hands and that people felt "healed" when he held his hands over them.

How did he fool himself? He ain't dumb- so what made him think that he had "magic" powers?? Apart from a massively inflated ego?


Feeling heat is an effect that does occur. I can't think of its name off the top of my head but it can be reproduced by anyone.

[Admin]

You make some very interesting points there, and I think that I probably fall into the category of one who isn't aware of how things can appear to work when they are bogus, also i have no idea how psychics, and the psychology of psychic readings, work.

Obviously I don't just believe everything I'm told, or I wouldn't be here lol but I'm not very scientifically knowledgeable at all.

So how do psychics and the psychology of psychic readings work?

by the way, i've never fancied it myself, but I thought acupuncture did actually work??


There's a few explanations for how medical interventions can appear to work here: http://www.ukskeptics.com/article.php?dir=articles&article=how_ineffective_treatments_appear_to_work. php

To discuss how psychic readings work we'll really need a new thread as it's a big topic.

There's some evidence to support acupuncture for mild pain relief but the claims made for it are usually grossly exaggerated.

[Mongrel]

You make some very interesting points there, and I think that I probably fall into the category of one who isn't aware of how things can appear to work when they are bogus, also i have no idea how psychics, and the psychology of psychic readings, work.

Obviously I don't just believe everything I'm told, or I wouldn't be here lol but I'm not very scientifically knowledgeable at all.

So how do psychics and the psychology of psychic readings work?

by the way, i've never fancied it myself, but I thought acupuncture did actually work??


There's a few explanations for how medical interventions can appear to work here: http://www.ukskeptics.com/article.php?dir=articles&article=how_ineffective_treatments_appear_to_work. php

To discuss how psychic readings work we'll really need a new thread as it's a big topic.

There's some evidence to support acupuncture for mild pain relief but the claims made for it are usually grossly exaggerated.


Depends how you define Acupuncture.
Traditional acupuncture relies on flow of Chi through meridians and sticking needles in to remove any blockages that occur.
More and more nowdays Acupuncture is used as a euphemism for "sticking needles in people to releive pain", this is the sort of goalpost shifting that the sCAMers love because, as John said there is some evidence that it can work for pain relief.

The needling evidence, IIRC (no time to look it up), said that it was about as effective as an over the counter painkiller and that placement in regards to meridians was unimportant, therefore not acupuncture.

[Admin]

A lot of what's 'known' about Acupuncture is actually false :o

Most 'traditional acupuncture' was invented in the 20th century.

Here's an article what I wrote: http://www.ukskeptics.com/article.php?dir=articles&article=acupuncture.php

There's a link at the bottom to EBM which lists a lot of trial etc.

[Physiotherapist]

Somatisation is a medical condition and yes, conventional medicine does not have a lot to offer, however any patient should be referred to a good psychotherapist for treatment to ascertain the underlying problem.

Also, as a physiotherapist and a bodyworker, I work with my hands when I treat people, as well as giving them stretching exercises etc. When you work with your hands all the time, they do tend to become more sensitive than normal.

[tkingdoll]

If you want to create some heat, create some friction! Rub your hands together vigorously for a few seconds them put the on your face. Oooh heat!

[Admin]

I've had it done to me. :o

I knew a bloke who was told by a 'healer' that he had 'the gift' (unfortunately this ended up in him becoming a fully-fledged, embarrassing Woo) and he wanted to demonstrate it on me.

He did his concentrating, touched my arm and asked me to feel the 'energy'. Much to my surprise I could feel it warm up quite markedly.

I looked into it (not that I believed it was healing energy) and there is an effect (that has a name that I can't remember >:() that works every time.

Anyone can try it. Just place your hand on someone (careful ;)) and ask them if they can feel the heat or energy and they will.

[Jocky]

So is this something other than simply the "healer's"natural body heat, plus a spot of suggestion? That's what it sounds like ... :ponder:

[Admin]

No, I think that's all it is but there's a name for the effect. This was about 5 or 6 years ago so I can't remember what it is.

I'll have a look under therapeutic touch or something and it will be described. O0

[Physiotherapist]

The thing is though that physiological effects do occur when you put your hands on someone.

As well as being a physiotherapist, I broadened my skills some time ago now and do therapeutic massage, sports massage and combine these with other bodywork techniques. Physiological effects do occur when you use your hands. I see this daily in my practice.

Before you all go on at me about research, I have had a university education when I did both my physiotherapy and bodywork and I have done cadaveric dissection, sharing cadavers with both medical and dental students. It was a requirement of our curriculum.

[Mongrel]

A lot of what's 'known' about Acupuncture is actually false :o

Most 'traditional acupuncture' was invented in the 20th century.

Here's an article what I wrote: http://www.ukskeptics.com/article.php?dir=articles&article=acupuncture.php

There's a link at the bottom to EBM which lists a lot of trial etc.


Faur enough, I'll go sit in the corner :-[

[Aardvark]

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/tt.html

[kath23]

I personally do reiki every day, and I enjoy it. I know it's 'balls' tho lol :) but I still like it. It helps me fall asleep (though it didn't work tonight.)

If all of the healing claims are stripped away and it's reduced to the psychology behind it, it's a form of prayer effectively. A spiritual/religious practice like any other. No evidence that any of them do much at all but for some reason a lot of people need 'something'- anything :o

Love
Kath

[Admin]

The problem with Reiki though is that people do make medical claims for it. In fact, that is the purpose of it!

How anyone can take it seriously however.....

[asthmatic camel]

In response to my efforts to spread the word about about the homeopathy campaign, I received this email from a friend, which I found amusing (edited for privacy.)


Don't mention it, Chap. Here at **** 'College', we have a department full of dopey women who administer these things to others and themselves on a regular basis, all of whom could do with psychological assistance, or a good rodding. They have called me out, in my capacity as a first-aider to one woman whom I found lying on a bed, having had what was described as 'a funny turn'; now that's even scant information to a grizzled old A & E consultant health professional, so you can imagine what I thought...Anyway, I discovered she'd been giving a 'treatment' to another unfortunate, by hovering her hands over them, [and presumably making a humming noise with her mouth], when she had 'a funny turn'. Somewhat weakly, I advised her to keep lying down until she felt better and left. Then, as you always do, afterwards, I came up with what I thought was the explanation; she'd perhaps had her hands upsidedown!

Pip pip!

xxx

[Blue Wode]

How anyone can take it seriously however.....


Well, we know that HRH, CAMilla, and quite a few others do…
http://www.fih.org.uk/whatwedo/Regulation/reggroups.htm

Although they may not be aware of the current internal frictions…

This from the Reiki Regulatory Working Group:

Our mission is to explore and establish public and professional standards to regulate the practice of Reiki in the UK.
- snip -
We live in a world of energy that nourishes and maintains all living things. When this energy flows uninterrupted there is balance and harmony within and around us and we experience a sense of well being.

http://www.reikiregulation.org.uk/


Oops. Not a very convincing advert for the profession when their own balance and harmony is being disrupted from within:


Reiki practitioners and teachers against regulation

THE PETITION
The petition is to prevent regulation being imposed on Reiki Practitioners and Teachers in the UK. We feel that the regulation of Reiki is neither necessary nor desirable for the majority of Reiki Practitioners and Teachers in the UK.

DESIRED OUTCOME
To prevent the voluntary self regulation being imposed on the majority of Reiki Practitioners and Teachers by the minority.

WHO WE NEED TO INFLUENCE
The entire Reiki community in the UK, the House of Lords and the RRWG.

HOW LONG WILL WE CAMPAIGN
As long as it takes!

http://petitionthem.com/default.asp?sect=detail&pet=3202


::)